http://smragan.com/2015/02/22/mse-5-the-weekend-project-that-wasnt/As animal fosters, our job is to bring dogs into our home and get them ready for their new forever home by loving them, feeding them, and playing with them. It is such a fulfilling and satisfying way that our family gives back. Other people view fostering differently. There was one woman who wanted to volunteer. She stated up front that she would “only foster dogs with a certain snout”, and currently she has never fostered a dog.
I have some people that want to discuss their hiring with me, who present similar requests. They will only work with people who attended a certain university. They will only hire people with a certain GPA. They will only have staff members who are members of certain organizations. And to what avail?
The organization that we foster through has a policy that they do not discriminate against people who want a dog. You don’t have to have a white picket fence and a doggy door to adopt a dog; you just have to provide a loving home. At A-list, we also do not discriminate against candidates – you just have to want to hire the best fit possible or you have to BE the best fit for the job.
The ultimate irony is that I have hired people from 16-85 years of age, each different types of people from varying backgrounds, because we focus on 3 things: working well with others, ability to do the job and passion for the job. Nothing else matters.
And the volunteer who wants only dogs with certain snouts? She probably won’t foster. The employers who wanted certain GPA’s? Statistically, they won’t be happy with their hire. And, I don’t work with people who want certain noses. I work with clients who want to have the best person on their staff and are willing to look past noses in order to find them, because it works.
I love it when an opportunity presents itself to listen in on a “normal” interview. Arriving early for an appointment at a Starbuck’s in the Denver area, I was enjoying an amazing cup of black tea as the store manager began interviewing for a potential staff member. As effective interviewing is my passion, I was fascinated by the exchange I observed.
First, the candidate entered the Starbucks as I did at 12:45. She sat nervously waiting for 15 minutes to begin the interview for her next potential position. While the manager did begin the interview at exactly 1:00 (kudos to her) a huge opportunity to set up the candidate for immediate success was missed. An A-list candidate will ALWAYS be 15 minutes early for an interview, especially for a position they are really interested in. If the interviewer actually leaves them waiting for 15 minutes, the candidate only becomes more nervous, thus increasing the chances to blow the interview.
Second, the manager talked for the entire interview, occasionally glancing at the resume of the candidate. The candidate very dutifully nodded her head (she will need a massage after this!) and laughed at all the manager’s jokes. In a truly effective interview, the hiring manager should be engaging in active listening, rather than explaining the position and requirements. If the manager is talking rather than asking questions, the candidate does not have the chance to share skills, abilities, and personality with the manager. By not listening, the manager really has very little knowledge about the applicant or how they can truly contribute to the team.
Third, the manager got up and left the table twice to handle other issues and the candidate was left sitting by herself. Now I realize life can be full of interruptions. However, during an interview, the only focus should be around the task at hand: assessing the skill set and cultural fit of the potential new employee. Continuous interruptions reduce the hiring manager’s ability to determine fit and the candidate’s confidence about the job environment.
Fourth, the manager interviewed this woman in front of an audience of roughly 10 people waiting for their coffee drinks. The interview lasted 42 minutes. So for 42 minutes this candidate was not only vulnerable and exposed to a hiring manager, but to an entire audience of people. Don’t hold interviews in public, high traffic areas. Respect is a cornerstone for any great relationship and public interviews are very disrespectful.
Last, but certainly not least, the manager discussed the highpoints of the candidate with another worker behind the counter, again in front of an audience. Do I really need to point out how disrespectful this is?
After my observances, I realized that this is a perfect example of a “normal” interview, meaning that most people conduct interviews just like this and wonder why they can’t hire good people. I honestly do not believe this hiring manager was even aware of her interviewing style and its ineffectiveness towards hiring a great employee. My big question is this: Was this manager really ever taught how to conduct an interview? Did she feel supported through the process, so that she could be successful in her hiring decisions? Did she really have the tools and environment needed to be successful in her decision making process?
Employers who truly desire amazing staff need to support their hiring managers by teaching them how to interview. Give them the proper tools to find the next generation of A-list employees needed to grow the business. This is the gift that keeps on giving.
My daughter once made a Christmas present for me that she didn’t want me to see. She had me bend down and she covered my eyes with her little hands. We stumbled along until we got to her room, and she pulled her hands away. My surprise was a diorama of Christmas at the Smith house, complete with the tree, presents, the stockings by the fireplace and my kid walking in on Santa going up the chimney. It is the cutest thing, and the detail was something that I never would have expected. It sits out on our bookshelf all year round, and I still remember covering my eyes and going blind in that great surprise.
When I begin working with a new client, I ask them to do something that they have never done before: I ask them to go into an interview with a candidate blind. Don’t read the resume. My client will know the candidate’s first name and that is it. Why? Because reading the resume before you meet the candidate gives you the ability to pre-judge. It feeds into our prejudices, and when you read a resume, you miss the surprise.
At A-list, we have a person in charge of screening resumes, and he is amazing at it! He developed a process for screening quickly and effectively, all the while, allowing my clients to be surprised by what the candidate brings to the table and checking their prejudices at the door. This process allows for more diversity, more ideas and more creativity in a company.
Next time you hire someone, have someone else screen for you. Don’t look at the resumes: be surprised by going blind into your next interview.
James “Doc” Counsilman, swim coach to the great Mark Spitz, was the oldest person to swim across the English Channel at the age of 58. What makes this story so remarkable? He had been diagnosed with Parkinson’s disease 4 years before that swim. In order to prepare for that amazing swim, he sat in ice cube baths to prepare for the cold water. When reporters asked about his pain level upon his completion, he said “it only hurt once… from beginning to end.”
Last week, I finished a job and hired a fabulous candidate for my client. We interviewed 38 people, had over 100 applicants, then we ran into wall after wall. We had multiple no-shows, offered the job to someone who couldn’t take it, and had someone walk out without shaking our out stretched hands. Upon our glorious candidate accepting the job, my client turned to me and said “Is there ANY way you can make this process less painful?”
The simple answer is no. I wish I could. Frankly, this process is not the most enjoyable business activity. Hence the reason businesses often put it off until the need for someone is so great that they have to begin the interview process. There will be days when you truly despise the process and even me as your interviewing coach. What you will get when you work with me is that I make your life so much easier after you go through this process and after we find the A-list new hire you are seeking. You WILL be able to take days off, you WILL be able to rest, you WILL be able to trust that things get done, and you WILL hurt a lot less once you swim that channel. And just like Doc said, “It will only hurt once…from beginning to end.”
I always find the hiring process fascinating, especially when I begin working with people who have had employees on staff for an extended period of time that are not a good fit. They almost always report to me “I knew it was not going to work out” after we get to a place where we are going to let go of an employee and begin searching for the perfect candidate to hire.
As many of my conversations with new clients go, I met with a potential new client who began the conversation with “You have to know that I am BAD at hiring.”
I said, “How do you know?”
He said, “Because I just fired the worst hire EVER.”
I asked, “When did you know that this employee was the worst hire ever?”
He said, “I knew the first day. I just KNEW it was not going to work out. And I have known that for 2 years.”
Now two years may be somewhat extreme, but I hear many of my clients report that they hired someone, knew they were not going to work out almost immediately, then left the person in the position for months if not years just to avoid having to interview again. Instead I challenge you fellow business owner to hire differently by really listening to the candidates during the interviews. They will tell you if they will not work out. You just have to listen.
For example, last week, I interviewed a candidate that my client really wanted to hire until we started talking about the language that this person used in the interview. It was always someone else’s fault, they didn’t get enough training, and the traffic was always terrible. The client looked at me with this hang dog look, like I had just burst his balloon. I commented “Do you know this one is a no?” He said “Yes. But I don’t want to know that it’s a no. I want a new employee!” This is the absolute most difficult part of the interview process. You are tired, you need help and you want this person to work out SO bad! But as another client of mine said, “When you shorten this process, you pay the piper.’ And he’s right. The price is an employee who you knew from the start would not work out. Then you have to go through the pain of firing and hiring all over again.
I encourage you to listen to yourself and the language of your potential new hires. You know when it’s a no. Wait until you know it’s a yes.
As animal fosters, our job is to bring dogs into our home and get them ready for their new forever home by loving them, feeding them, and playing with them. It is such a fulfilling and satisfying way that our family gives back. Other people view fostering differently. There was one woman who wanted to volunteer. She stated up front that she would “only foster dogs with a certain snout”, and currently she has never fostered a dog.
My daughter once made a Christmas present for me that she didn’t want me to see. She had me bend down and she covered my eyes with her little hands. We stumbled along until we got to her room, and she pulled her hands away. My surprise was a diorama of Christmas at the Smith house, complete with the tree, presents, the stockings by the fireplace and my kid walking in on Santa going up the chimney. It is the cutest thing, and the detail was something that I never would have expected. It sits out on our bookshelf all year round, and I still remember covering my eyes and going blind in that great surprise.
James “Doc” Counsilman, swim coach to the great Mark Spitz, was the oldest person to swim across the English Channel at the age of 58. What makes this story so remarkable? He had been diagnosed with Parkinson’s disease 4 years before that swim. In order to prepare for that amazing swim, he sat in ice cube baths to prepare for the cold water. When reporters asked about his pain level upon his completion, he said “it only hurt once… from beginning to end.”
I always find the hiring process fascinating, especially when I begin working with people who have had employees on staff for an extended period of time that are not a good fit. They almost always report to me “I knew it was not going to work out” after we get to a place where we are going to let go of an employee and begin searching for the perfect candidate to hire.